Wernars, Jos; Paul Van Velzen; Peter De Frankfijker; and Ernest Wernars (US) (July 2002)

The Story Of US

Maybe there are some little faults in their "re-appearance" entitled A Sorrow In Our Hearts, but I think that with the small budget they had to play with, US made the best album they could do. In fact I hope that some label will soon pick up this fine melodic prog act, because they seem to possess great reflections and ideas too. Just read this interview and start to wonder if there's some sorrow in your heart...

Igor Italiani: Hi members of US ... so can we start talking about your beginnings as musicians, 'cause I've read that your adventure in the prog universe started quite a while ago (under the name Saga, which was also used by another great pomp rock band still alive)?

Jos Wernars: Yeah, you are right, most of us were caught by the "sympho" virus long ago. This kind of music has it all. There is plenty of room for melody, but also for sheer power and even aggression. Basically what music is all about.

Paul Van Velzen: I always favored music with strong melodic lines as well as rhythm. Being 15 or 16 I preferred bands like Bread, Chicago, Moody Blues instead of Beatles and Rolling Stones. Songs like "MacArthur Park" and "Tin Soldier" by The Small Faces really got to me. It was then that I met Jos and a few years later discovered Yes and Genesis. They really converted me to symphonic rock.

Peter De Frankfijker: Well, actually, when these guys were touring as Saga, I was still riding around on rollerskates and watching Pippi Longstockings all day [...!?!?! - II]. But I got a guitar when I was 14, and have been playing all kinds of music as long as it poses a challenge - either artistically or technically. I never really was that much into prog or sympho, I was playing more solid rock like Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Rush and Rainbow. Joining US has really turned my head towards the sympho corner, though.

Ernest Wernars: My first steps in music were attempts to copy Hank B. Marvin in the early sixties. Although I started by playing the role of lead guitarist, later on I felt more attracted to the deep sound of the bass-guitar. In Saga I played bass until our keyboardist quit and I decided to give it a try. I have always been attracted to melodic music whether that would be 'modern' or classic. Within the symph/prog scene, Genesis are my favorites by far. Admiration for them reduced a bit from Abacab onwards.

II: What was the turning point that sparkled your return to recording and playing the progressive genre?

JW: It is a matter of falling in love, really. You just want to be part of it; at least that is what happened to US. The challenge of making that kind of music, and stretching yourself was really appealing, and so we could not resist and tried ourselves.

PVV: Pure chemistry as well. Jos hadn't been playing anything since the breaking up of Saga. He and Ernest had sold all their instruments. The day Jos told me that he'd bought a new guitar I knew it would lead to this.

EW: I guess I was the one to start it all. After having done nothing for years I got "the itch" in 1998 and decided to take up playing keys again. I bought a new synth and took piano lessons to catch up. Sat together with Jos and Paul and then...

II: Talking about your new beginning, A Sorrow In Our Hearts, can you immediately tell me if the title of the album has some deeper meaning?

JW: It surely does, it is the subtitle of a beautiful epic written by Allan J. Eckert, an American historic novelist. This particular book tells the story of Tecumseh, a Shawnee warrior who recognized the trouble his nation was in, and had enough common sense to see what was needed to turn it around. But as always, greed and egos seem to have the upper hand, and so his master plan failed and in the end even caused his death. A story about a great human being, who deserved better. A great book by the way. A sorrow in our hearts sort of compiles the general feel of our album. So many things that have gone lost because of greed and false emotions.

II: So this is the reason why the cover of the album depicts a Native American?

JW: The cover sort of resembles Tecumseh; however, we have no idea what he really looked like. Paul, who took care of the whole graphic process, came up with this beautiful and meaningful picture. I really love it, because it says it all.

PVV: Someone mentioned that the cover of the album didn't resemble the covers you'd usually expect in the progressive scene. I didn't mind. Our music is about everyday life, past or present, so why use images that refer to fantasy or sci-fi? And though we really don't know who this Native American is, let alone if he's a Shawnee, we thought this picture to be meaningful for the album, as he represents millions of people that suffered one way or another.

II: Now talking about the songs ... you all sing some lines in the tunes, but who takes more vocal duties in the end?

JW: Paul and myself do most of the singing. Paul has the better voice, no doubt. However in some passages I think my voice fits better and in others, Paul's. Point is that we are in fact looking for a voice that really fits it all, but have not found it yet. So until then we only have our own voices to rely on, but sure the vocals can be better...

PVV: A good number of critics mention the vocals as being the weakest part of US. I feel they are right and we aim to resolve that on the next album. Either with a real singer or paying even more attention to our own singing, like adding more vocal harmonies.

PD: I disagree, a lot of reviews don't even mention the vocals as a sore spot. I asked a couple of the reviewers, and they either didn't notice or didn't feel that the voice was out of place. In my opinion, some of the most successful bands in the world have lead vocalists that could be considered "bad" or at least "exceptional." Names like Neil Young, David Gilmour or Bob Dylan spring to mind. Charlie Watts isn't the best drummer in the world, but he plays in (one of) the best bands nonetheless.

II: How much time did it take to write the songs of this new album? Are you already working on a follow-up or on new material?

JW:. A lot of time, I can tell you that. It is a whole process. It starts with a feeling, generally meandering itself to the song itself. Most of the time Ernest and I work out the general idea, which really comes together when Paul and Peter fall in. Only then we can really give it form.

PVV: Having had a small hand in writing the lyrics for "Forever Yours," I agree with Jos that it isn't easy. I think Jos has a great talent for writing stories (he actually wrote some unpublished books!) as well as putting them on music, and it surely takes a lot of effort doing it in a foreign language too. But, as I already gave away in my latter answer, we are indeed working on songs for a new album and together with a number of songs written in the Saga period we have enough material to make at least 3 albums. The way things are looking now we plan to record the second album at the beginning of next year.

PD: Writing music with these guys is something amazing ... Jos comes up with these great ideas (one of the things I like about US is Jos' lyrics, which I think contribute to more of half of the appeal of the songs) and we just go with the flow, adding stuff, breaks, licks, solos. It'll take a while before I can get my two cents in the way the other three do (being the Band Benjamin) but once the process gets underway, it's really a fantastic creative process. I'm sure we'll manage to come up with some more interesting songs in the future.

EW: We have been working more than a year to get the songs in their current shape. But in that period we have created more songs than the ones recorded on this CD. As already answered by Jos we work out a general concept with lyrics, chords and even suggestions which instrument plays which part. Rhythm themes are generally worked out between Jos and Paul. Peter and myself are supposed to emphasize the melodies.

II: Can you tell me the story (lyrics-wise) that lies behind "The Acid Dream"?

JW: This is a hot topic, as far as I am concerned. I have no moral objection whatsoever about prostitution or even taking drugs. The latter does not seem too healthy, if you catch my drift, but that is up to every individual. As long as you don't harm anybody else, it's your own body, so it is also your responsibility. Governments should control the use instead of banning it. That would keep it out of the criminal section. Prostitution is no problem at all, as long as there is no force and exploitation involved. If a person, female or male, wants to make easy money and someone else is willing to pay? Who cares? My point with this particular song is the fact that people take incredible risks involving other people (partners?) who have no clue as to what is happening to them. That is something I do not understand. The prostitute I feel sorry for, because she really has no other options, but the customer is plain stupid!

PD: It's an intriguing song; I didn't get the meaning until after listening to it a few times. I like the instrumental ending, too, though, it's like watching the soul floating away from the body.

II: You released A Sorrow In Our Hearts as an independent release ... are you satisfied by the feedback already generated by the album? Has some label approached you with the option of a brand new contract?

JW: Yes, we haven't had a "bad" review yet, all of them are good and some really great. What else can you wish for as a starting band? However I think that the average boy or girl group spends more production budget on a single than we did on the whole album! We now have a distribution agreement with Musea, who has taken the album in their catalogue. The rest is still under negotiation, we will see what comes up.

PVV: Another reason to finance the first album is that we didn't want to go through a series of merely disappointing correspondence with record companies, which is usually the case when you send a demo. We wanted to see if we could manage it ourselves and in the process see how people like yourself would react. Record companies are much like banks. They'll lend you money provided that you give them twice the value as a collateral. And since there are no such guarantees in the music business, no one is eager to invest in a new band, especially not this type of music. Still, that's what marketing is all about, and we would welcome interested parties, even on a co-investment base.

II: Are you planning some live show to support your release? What about the prog scene in your country?

JW: We are certainly putting together a live show. Especially with Peter joining us, we have grown into a very progressive live performance. As far as prog in general is concerned, I can only say that it still is a difficult market. Especially for us, everything costs loads of money and the revenues are not good. Each copy of our album sold is a contribution to the next, though and for now we are determined to go for it.

PVV: I'm convinced that we can kick some ass on stage. The show will be quite energetic. So if any prog-rock festival organizers read this, please contact US through [our website].

PD: Well, when I told the people around me that I joined a sympho band, they got a little too sympathetic for my taste. Like "aww, how nice...," you know, the way an old lady talks to a baby when it's got a new rattler. I don't think they took it quite so seriously. I'm "a bit younger" than the rest of the band (by a factor two, almost) so most of the people around me had either never heard of sympho or thought it was some extinct Rock Dinosaur. They usually think "Yes" is the opposite of "No," that "Genesis" is the first chapter of the bible and Rick Wakeman is just some man who never sleeps. But now that they see that the record is really taking off, they kinda repositioned their opinions. Nowadays they fear me, which is a good thing, ha-ha. About going on tour: when I first joined the band, they told me that touring was very unlikely because Jos did bass guitar, lead guitar, rhythm guitar AND lead vocals, which is impossible to do on stage unless you learn how to play the guitar with your toes and earlobes. But when they asked me to join, they opened up the possibility to gig. Which posed me with a challenge! I have recorded some guitar parts layering up to five guitars on top of each other (the "and she goes down" part of "Acid Dream," for instance). But we'll find a good workaround for that, I'm sure. Anyway, playing in a band without ever going on stage is like a pencil with an eraser on each end: pointless [by the way great metaphor! - II].

II: We already said that you are not so new to the music scene ... what are the main differences in your opinion between now and the scene of 10, 20 years ago?

JW: In fact prog or sympho has always been open for debate by the so-called "critics." Even when Genesis and Yes were at their peak there were always people who said it was no rock and roll! Of course it wasn't, which is precisely my point. They were making music, and that was the main purpose. I get really annoyed by the generally accepted idea that "good" music can only be made by musicians who live their life on the edge. That you have to suffer from drugs, alcohol and live in the gutters of society, just to be able to write meaningful lyrics. And when you happen to live your life like everybody else, your music cannot be good, let alone innovating. I really loathe that.

PVV: Ehhh .... I think the way I wear my hair .... No seriously. The funny thing is that quite a lot of those bands still record and perform today, and successfully I might add. So, has anything changed really?

PD: Yes, I also think that the way Paul wears his hair is the most important change. :-)

EW: 20 years ago it seemed as if we were just a bit too late with our contribution. Now it sometimes looks as if there is a renewed interest in symph/prog. Internet and e-mail make communication easy which results in a lot of "digital" attention for our efforts. In the end it all comes down to getting the attention of the CD buying audience so that difference (which really makes the difference) should proof soon.

II: Is there a dream you would like to fulfill?

JW: Being recognized as one of the great symphonic bands around. Being able to spend more time doing it.

PVV: Support act to one of the renowned prog-rock bands, as long as it is not Dream Theater. Knowing that Mike Portnoy is playing right after me is enough to make me give up drumming and start knitting. Boy, is he good! Come to think of it, that also applies to Nick D' Virgilio, as well as a few others.

PD: Well, I'm pretty pleased with having played on a CD, which had always been a dream of mine. I'd like to record a few more to show my grandchildren that in his days, granddad was a really cool guy. A feature in a guitar magazine would help a lot, too. I think it's all about being recognized and remembered for being a good musician. Oh, that AND growing back my hair, that would be nice, too.

EW: I agree with my brother that recognition plays a very big role. For the moment I settle with the choice of a record company that gives us the chance to do a more professional recording supported by a producer. Apart from my dreams I am looking forward to go on stage and convince the audience of our live capabilities.

II: I have no more questions boys. There's something else you would like to add before the end?

JW: Thanks for giving us this opportunity, we really appreciate that.

PVV: I'm off practicing rolls and paradiddles and such. Thanks.

EW: Thanks for your review and this interview, I'll keep you posted concerning our new CD.

[US have released 7 CDs since this interview; their most recent is The Road Less Travelled -ed.]

Discography:
Saga - To Whom It Concerns (1975/6)
The Wizzard Of Us (ltd. edition demo) (1990s)
A Sorrow In Our Hearts (2002)
Eamon's Day (2003)
The Ghost of Human Kindness (2004)
The Young and the Restless (2006)
Reflections (2007)
Climbing Mount Improbable (2008)
Everything Changes (2009)
Feeding The Crocodile (2010)
The Road Less Travelled (2011)